Curse

Alexandra-Sweet · Oct 14, 2008, 08:13 PM // 20:13

To keep things short: my insurance company kind of needs to know what this effect is called. >.>

Lord Sojar · Oct 15, 2008, 03:35 AM // 03:35

Artifacting to be quite short and simple.

Linear 2D artifacting caused by SiDeg.

Hope that helps Alexandra.

Alexandra-Sweet · Oct 15, 2008, 10:00 AM // 10:00

I tried Googling/Wiking for SiDeg, nothing but glibberish (as in some arabic language) showed up.

PS. Did you ninja edit my original post?

Lord Sojar · Oct 16, 2008, 05:49 AM // 05:49

lol, sorry. Used a common abbreviation we use in the lab.

SiDeg stands for silicon degradation. Is is the breakdown of gate dielectrics from excessive heat/voltage/bad doping.

And yes, I ninja edited it.

Brianna · Oct 16, 2008, 05:43 PM // 17:43

I'm surprised that ''Silicon Degradation'' has never happened to any of my stuff yet, considering how hot everything always is.

Warranty?

Alexandra-Sweet · Oct 16, 2008, 06:28 PM // 18:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brianna

I'm surprised that ''Silicon Degradation'' has never happened to any of my stuff yet, considering how hot everything always is.

Probably because you don't have an older brother that pulls the video card out of your computer while it's turned on (too bad he didn't got electrocuted.)

Brianna · Oct 16, 2008, 08:54 PM // 20:54

ROFL. Oh damn.. I'm surprised he didn't get shocked too. That could really mess you up.

Ok yeah that would probably fry something *facepalm*.

Quaker · Oct 16, 2008, 09:35 PM // 21:35

There's little chance of getting a shock while pulling a video card - unless you use your tongue, or stand in a grounded bucket of water - the voltages used aren't high enough. (12v max)

Brianna · Oct 17, 2008, 01:18 AM // 01:18

Oh? Not a theory I'm willing to test anyway.

How about the motherboard?

Lord Sojar · Oct 17, 2008, 06:56 AM // 06:56

Voltage doesn't kill, amperes do. A PSU outputs MORE than enough amps through the 12v rail to kill you instantly.

To put it in perspective for you:

You can get shocked by 10,000,000 volts and it will hurt like, but if the current was only 40mA, it will only hurt, nothing more.

You can get shocked by 5volts, but if that 5 volts is 20A, you are deader than a doornail.

This doesn't mean that high voltage won't kill you though. High voltage typically designates high amperage. Keyword, typically.

Alexandra-Sweet · Oct 17, 2008, 07:37 AM // 07:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rahja the Thief

lol, sorry. Used a common abbreviation we use in the lab.

Lab? Lab? Lab? O.o
Do they wear labcoats there? I like labcoats, I just don't like them being white... why not black? And what's the difference between labcoats and doctercoats!? Labcoats with built in ESD protection are fun too, except a bit heavy. >.>

Lord Sojar · Oct 17, 2008, 08:11 AM // 08:11

Yes, labcoats are required, as well as full cleansuits in certain areas (mainly the areas where suspended nano particles are housed, or ESD sensitive product/equipment)

This is the lab, mainly the photolithography cleanroom.

Here is Titan, a very advanced scanning electron microscope.

Alexandra-Sweet · Oct 17, 2008, 09:28 AM // 09:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rahja the Thief

Yes, labcoats are required, as well as full cleansuits in certain areas (mainly the areas where suspended nano particles are housed, or ESD sensitive product/equipment)

Those aren't labcoats those are like.... condoms. >.>
And I hate those rediculess hair net things.
Goggles are funny though!

Brianna · Oct 17, 2008, 03:12 PM // 15:12

Too picky Alexandra! :P

Anyway, I think the white just looks more ''scientist'' like, but that's just me.

Quaker · Oct 17, 2008, 06:51 PM // 18:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rahja the Thief

Voltage doesn't kill, amperes do. A PSU outputs MORE than enough amps through the 12v rail to kill you instantly.

Oh... My... God!
A short course in Ohms law is obviously required here.

Ohms law - V(volts)=I(current in amps) x R(resistance)

To calculate current we transpose to I = V/R

The resistance of human skin under dry conditions varies a lot, but is on the order of 100,000 ohms or more. Skin resistance goes down if the skin is wet, (thus my caution about tongues and buckets of water), but is still in the order of 10,000 ohms.

So I=12/100,000 >> 120 microamps (0.12 milliamps) - you won't even feel it.

I=12/10,000 >> 1.2 milliamps - less than the threshold of perception for DC (http://www.allaboutcircuits.com/vol_1/chpt_3/4.html)

It doesn't matter what the power supply is capable of in amps - it will only deliver the amount allowed by the resistance in the circuit. This applies to your computer too - the current is dependent upon the resistance. Power supplies are rated for what they can deliver not what they do deliver.
The only part of a computer that has enough voltage to harm you (without using your tongue or standing in water) is the input circuits of the power supply where the 110 VAC from the wall is found. You'd have to physical open up the power supply to get at them.
Note - 110VAC can kill you.

In my life as an Electronics Technologist I've gotten many shocks - 110VAC, 440volts AC (that hurt), 12000 volts DC (blew a hole in my elbow and made me pause for a bit

) and others. But I've never gotten a shock from a computer or a car (also 12volts).

Which reminds me that some people also have the same misconception about car batteries "because they have 100amps". Actually, you can grab both terminals on a car battery and you won't feel a thing (if you're sweaty you may feel a slight tingle). The danger with car batteries is the acid inside them, the hydrogen given off, and the sparks/heat/melted-stuff that can happen if you short them out with a (metal) tool, but not shocks.

If you want to try something harmless but interesting, try sticking your tongue across the terminals of a standard 9volt battery. You'll feel a little tingle and it "tastes" strangely acidic. (I guess the "sour" taste buds are on the tip of your tongue.)

Snograt · Oct 18, 2008, 01:16 AM // 01:16

Heh, that's how I always test 9v batteries, Quaker - quite a jolt if they're fresh!

I've had so many shocks throughout my life, I reckon I'm immune. Some of the house wiring I've seen is downright dangerous - and almost invariably council property.

Hehe - why can't I shake the image of Brianna suffering from silicone degredation?

(Oh, and Quaker - don't forget we superior Brits and our 240VAC

)

Lord Sojar · Oct 18, 2008, 05:50 AM // 05:50

<------ Doctor of physics...

Ohms proves what I said. Voltage is directly proportional to amperage, but current is dependent on resistance. Electro physics 101 much?

And you are assuming a generic value for the resistance of human skin, with no variables included minus water, which generally drops resistance to only 1000 ohms or less (dependent on water, assuming tap water with a ppm rating similar to that defined by most water companies)

A PSU carries more than enough current to kill you. The issue is, most of that current is lost to resistance, as you stated. However, touch a 12+ volt rail @60+ amperes, and you do indeed risk death (many modern PSUs output around 60-85amps on the 12+ volt rail). Skin is always "wet", via sweat from the pores. Pores are also a direct route for electricity to our internal systems, which lowers resistance to about 400-500ohms, or less depending on the area of the body (nerve cells are very low, on the order of 150-200 ohms). You also must take into account our body's bio electricity, and that you are adding into that pool. That is why 90-100mA can stop your heart, which isn't much...

Using ohms law, as you did...

You are looking at 75mA - 120mA, depending on conditions. It can kill you, provided the variables match up and what condition your heart is in.

And no.... the capacitors inside a power supply are MORE THAN ENOUGH to fry you like a fish and chips basket.

PS:

Insurance companies are EVIL.